You can’t Ascend if you’re already a God Tier, regardless of the conditions. Only way you can achieve more than your God Tier is prototyping yourself with another God Tier, in which case it’s not God Tier^2, rather, just. Two titles in one.
I mean, Jade was brought to the Quest Bed really quickly after death. You don’t need to die immediately on it, but there IS a time limit for going God Tier- Usually, your Dream Self will start to die, so you have until it dies to put your corpse in the bed. Crypts are weirder though because they allow ascension without a secondary you, so I’m assuming it requires instant death on it? Otherwise it’d be way too easy to just bring everyone’s corpses to the moon.
And that’s where the Consciousness problem comes in! Consciousness as a stream of being, and Soul as snapshots in different points of that stream. When you go to sleep and wake up on Prospit or Derse, your consciousness continues as if you were the same being, but once either body or dream self die, there’s a split. One part dies for good, and the other continues to live on. Which are you? That’s a philosophical conundrum, and very similar to the whole Teleporter dilemma- If you’re not warping somewhere, rather, having your atomical structure undone, then reformed somewhere else, are you the original anymore? Jade is briefly in the Bubbles and learns some stuff, but the issue is- If the Soul snaps back to the body, then it’s the Soul of the Dream Self that gets left behind, either assimilated into one and sort of erased, or to wander the Bubbles, and if it doesn’t snap back and it remains there while the God Tier retains the memories of the other’s Soul, then the original body’s Soul is left to wander the Bubbles! There’s really no winning move, God Tier requires a sacrifice, one way or another, you’re risking absolute oblivion or losing a part of your ‘self’. Or perhaps ‘gaining’ a part of yourself? However you may want to see it.
If you Die and manage to get there in time, it’s worth a shot at the very least, but intentionally taking your life to Ascend… It’s really a heavy question. Is it worth it? Is it necessary? The risks entailed, the split of your being, the loss of a life.
Alpha Timeline, the Alpha would ascend, the other wouldn’t. In fact I’d dare say such a scenario may be impossible, it’s likely given one would be a Doomed Timeline, to avoid such a mess, the Doomed Timeline would just. Not allow the death to happen on the Quest Bed through Shenanigans.
Have we considered the possibility of the Sprite splitting and the components ascending individually?
Or better yet, the Sprite Spritexplodes and ruins BOTH Ascensions instead.
Not ‘Headcanons’ so to say- Well maybe Headcanons? But also just messing around for fun. The Rage Denizen, I like the idea of Lyssa, a purple snake body with a white body similar to Echidna, but two heads, each wearing a half of a Tragedy/Comedy mask, or a single head wearing both, depends. Thyone as the Heart Denizen, as a humanoid with a skirt of electric pink-ish energy, and a prominent heart shape on her torso. Moros, the Doom Denizen, with a cloak covering its body. Sophia as the Mind Denizen, with a third eye, wings, and a greek-style gown. And Alastor, the Denizen of Blood, as a red snake monster with his eyes blindfolded and a scarred body.
Those were my OLD Headcanons though, which I made a long while ago, and before I noticed Abraxas may not be the Hope Denizen, but rather, the ‘weakest’ Denizen that Karkat implies, to go along with Yaldabaoth as the ‘strongest’ Denizen. Currently I’m DMing a SBURB Campaign, and I made up new Denizens for the Players.
So with Yaldabaoth and Abraxas as non-Aspect Aligned Denizens, my current sort of idea for fun Denizens is Sophia (First one) for the Hope Denizen, Osiris (Second) for the Heart Denizen, Lyssa (Fifth) for the Rage Denizen, Dullahan (Sixth) for the Doom Denizen, and Azazel (Seventh) for the Blood Denizen, leaving only the Mind Denizen unaccounted for? I still like the idea of the Third Eye for the Mind Denizen, although I don’t know what it could be like.
MADE IN HEAVEN for Time.
But only if both corpses were wearing the Potara Earrings prior to their deaths.
It’s a Jojo Reference my dude, I’m. Not quite going to mention what it does because it’s Spoilers, but you can look up the Jojo Wiki. In fact just look pretty much any major villain from Jojo for cool Aspect Power references, specially Time.
Jojo’s Bizarre Adventure, Manime were swole men pose extravagantly while beating each other up, and later on, the style tones down the buffness in favor for making them all into Twunks.
Create like 200 contingency plans and plot points without any actual cohesion. You don’t know what your Players are going to Prototype or what they may fuck up or do with their Quests, so plan the Land Quests, plan the Plot Points, but allow the nature of SBURB to take its course and see what arises as the story progresses naturally.
Also, foreshadow, even if things may turn out differently, if you manage to pull off some foreshadowing for future events, they will get super excited.
And use the Horrorterrors and Clouds wisely.
And aren’t we all a part of the Universe, my friend?
There are a few projects going on, the Overseer v2 and the Genesis Project.
Olives, Fuchsias, Violets and Teals don’t seem to have powers. Indigos are implied to be generally stronger, but that may also not count exactly as a power, more than a trait. Limes likely had some powers but we have no idea what those powers are.
Oh yeah true! Although that’s more of a generator rather than a playable thing.
Ghosts are tied to Heart, so Seer or Mage of Heart would make the most sense.
I mean, her ‘real self’ was already dead long before and she kind of blew up similar to how Jade’s Dreambot died when her Dream Self died.
Yeah, except as I mentioned, whether some of them are waking before Ascension, or they’re permanently dead, is another whole existential debate.
Prospit doesn’t mean ‘good’ and Derse doesn’t mean ‘bad’, that’s how.
Also, the Dreaming Moons is an extremely and difficultly arbitrary can of worms:
What exactly determines whether a person is a Derse or Prospit dreamer? Or is it just random?
I wouldn’t say random, but it’s certainly vague. I guess it’s a little like sorting hat logic in Harry Potter (which I have a really halfassed understanding of because I haven’t read it), but even more vague, and more binary.
You get some sense there is rhyme and reason to it when you look at the personality types of the two groups. John, Jade, Jake, Jane vs Rose, Dave, Dirk, Roxy. And the troll groups were divided by their teams, red vs blue. Blue team (Derse) was generally stocked with more scheming members. Red team (Prospit) had some more straightforward heroic types, at least as far as trolls go. But then there can be oddball designations that don’t seem to make sense by such simplistic parameters, like Vriska being on Prospit. If she and Nepeta were swapped the criteria might seem more clear cut. See again, sorting hat logic. Like I think Harry was supposed to be in Slytherin because he could talk snakes and was kind of moody and shit but he was just SO BRAVE and loved friendship SO MUCH he got put in the other one. But for real, my fanfic where he was a Slytherin all along is so much better. (he is naked in most of it)
You could also look to the passive/active nature of the classes in making some retroactive sense of the Derse/Prospit dreamer duality. Passive/active classes are also a pretty vague thing, and don’t resolve so easily into simple dualities like defensive/offensive and such. Those are the guidelines for understanding them, but there is clearly a lot of flexibility within that system. They seem to suggest tendencies rather than absolute capabilities. Like there isn’t a rule that says a passive class could never use an offensive technique. The system is meant to be very flexible, and in the story, classes suggest a little more about a hero’s path and role in the greater quest than what their battle capabilities are.
But if we’re saying active/passive literally translates to offensive/defensive for the sake of this topic, then Derse would be very active and Prospit would be very passive. Derse’s job is to attack. Prospit’s is to defend. This seems to carry over to the roles of the dreamers too. Dave and Rose turned out to be very active players. Dave time traveling all over the place, making a fortune on stocks and such. Rose went on her crazy solo mission to break the game and fight Jack. Jade and John had more passive roles through most of that, players who were “acted upon” by other players and circumstances. John was always being led around by trolls this way and that, drifting around wherever the wind took him. Jade was especially passive for a lot of the story, spending a lot of time falling asleep (or being put to sleep) at key moments. It wasn’t until she reached god tier as a Witch (said to be a highly active class) that she became extremely active, making lots of stuff happen, rounding up planets and all that. Rose may have been a similar case, being excessively active as a Derse dreamer, but then flipping over to a passive role upon reaching god tier as a passive class.
Being from Derse means you are from a culture of offense and aggression. Being from Prospit means the opposite. You could argue that these are qualities that either rub off on the dreamers, or they are designated as those dreamers in the first place because of those qualities. You could take the view that these are innate tendencies to overcome, as seemed to be the case for Jade and Rose. Or maybe sometimes they are tendencies that are resisted, and need to be understood and embraced. As a Prospit dreamer, did Karkat struggle because he was actually passive in nature, but had a very active self image as a leader and conqueror? Was Vriska an even more extreme case of misplaced active behavior from a Prospit dreamer? These are yet more things to consider when looking at everything contributing to the hero story of an individual in this game.
It’s hard to tell straight away- Specially because also, the Witch being on Prospit makes less sense than her being on Derse, and same as the Seer being on Derse, if anything it may have been not to showcase backwardness but just like… How Classes, regardless of passive/active alignment, are influenced by the environment?
Dave’s Symbolism with swords goes deep, however what it means is up for debate. For me, Swords are a symbol of Heroism, but in Dave’s case, he comes to associate Bro as a Heroic Figure- As such, the symbolism of the swords is twisted in his Mind. If Bro is a Hero, then he is not one, because of the abuse suffered by him, he struggles seeing himself as Heroic, and as such can never manage to take the Sword from its pedestal in a normal manner. Swords, and Fighting, come to embody Toxic Masculinity and Abuse in Dave’s eyes, and while he comes to appreciate Dirk, he IS still the teen embodiment of the figure that abused him for so long. As such, destroying the Unbreakable Katana as he decapitates Dirk, is a moment of overcoming his past, one last Fight, one last Slice, to tear through his history of abuse and pain, one last jab at his awful brother, before they can finally put everything behind. Dave becomes, undoubtedly, a Hero, but strikes down the symbolism representing the toxic Heroic Ideals he’s been raised with.
On the contrary, you have Roxy, who instead of rejecting the ideals the Sword embodies, she twists them- Just like how she takes it out of the ground with her Void Powers, no pulling, no breaking, she uses her own methods, and in turn, makes the sword mean what she wants it to mean. For her, the sword is not Bro’s, it’s Dirk’s, and as a tombstone, it comes to embody, she tell us, everyone who didn’t make it up to the end. The will, the hopes and dreams, of everyone, from every timeline that died along the way for them to reach the point they’re at, and as such, while she delivers the final blow on Condy, it’s not her, but the combined strength of every single character in Homestuck that wanted to be happy and didn’t get a happy ending, that’s behind that last strike.
I believe there’s an archive blog but I don’t know the name right off the top of my head. Likely to pop up if you just google “Hussie Tumblr Archive” though.
I mean, by the time Rose connected there were meteors everywhere so it’s possible the meteors did start coming before the Kids started to play. Either way, if you re-read the review, Game Bro didn’t even start the game, but still gave it a low score, to keep it real.
Also, about Gamzee’s Prospit sway, based on the extended Zodiac’s description of a Prospit Dreamer, it makes a lot of sense. For most of the story, he is very complacent. He rarely acts, but when he does it is very sudden, abrupt, as he is the embodiment of capricious. It isn’t until he sobers up and is sent the ICP video that he acts, because he’s reacting, still willing to just serve Caliborn/ Lord English without question.
There’s a lot to the Passive-Active Divide, because it takes upon the concept of the Yin-Yang, where the divide is of pretty much everything ever, and ever-shifting, so it’s hard to pin-point a solid metric to divide them by. And yeah, I mean a lot of what Gamzee does fits the Passive category, but the answer before was more tying in to what I perceived to be specifically calling out his rampage-y behavior, isolatedly.
Huh, ‘not wearing the right colors’ implies Maid of anything except Heart.
I mean it’s a term the last anon coined on the spot. I learned I was a Seer of Doom from a Dream, and people occasionally have Dreams in which they are a specific God Tier.
I mean you don’t need to overthink it! If you wanna be Derse, be Derse.
Whichever you like the best, really.
Nah that’s a cool role.
Dreams are already hard enough to remember properly or manipulate to be what you want, so Classpect Dreams aren’t too common sadly!
That could be a fun way to visualize a Seer’s powers, yeah.
That’s Purples. Indigo is Equius’ Caste.
Rust - Bronze - Gold - Lime
Olive - Jade - Teal - Cerulean
Indigo - Purple - Violet - Fuchsia
After all, who knows you better than yourself? :p Nah but also it’s just a fun starting point, I just happened to really identify with both the Seer and Doom, for example.
Seeing the path for the most positive outcome, knowing about faith and other’s beliefs, religious guides, trying to make sense out of the chaos that is SBURB or whatever it is they are dealing with, there’s a few things that come to mind immediately.
They’re Jujus, one of their main traits is the fact their existence is dubious and cyclical. However, the Ring of Void appears to be, potentially, the Black Queen Ring from the Alpha Session, and the Ring of Life was given by Hussie of all people to Vriska, who then punched it off his hands, then Tavros took it, then John, and now it’s currently on Calliope’s hand. There’s also theories stating they’re both the same and One Ring.
No problem! I enjoy Classpect Analysis although I’ll admit it can be a bit draining sometimes.
Whichever you identify with the most!
The Moth Realization. It goes deeper than that- Kanaya, raised by a Moth, loves making clothes, and is shown to have been attracted to two Light Players.
Instant win.
Aranea had aeons to hone her skills in the Dream Bubbles, Vriska is 13 years old (+however many sweeps she spends in the Bubbles). Aranea also does NOT have telekinesis, she’s mind-controlling a bunch of Damaras on the Bubbles and using their Telekinesis by proxy.
I don’t know if they’d be able to pull that off without making the Sprite (or yourself) unstable and volatile, but it’d be a fun way to un-prototype.
It raises questions though like, would you need a vessel for the Soul you pulled out? Would the Sprite go a prototyping down, or would it straight-up die? It’s up to anyone’s guess I’d assume.
I mean, Seppucrow is a Crow and a Katana as one single Prototyping, so you CAN have two things count as the same ‘Tier’, if you can add onto Sprites like that I wouldn’t imagine it’d change much.
Yes and No. Generally, Sprites are just icons until they enter the Medium, at which point they Split. Two-Tier Prototyping before Entry seems to consistently make the Sprite take its final form even before splitting. And on top of that, some Tier-1 Prototypings Pre-Entry have been shown to be more than just a head- With Aradia’s Frogsprite seeming to be the full Sprite inside of the Kernel, and Bec got the tail to fly up because, I believe Hussie mentioned, “It’d look just goofy if it was just a Bec Head floating up and firing a laser beam.” Additionally, some Kernels may get peripheral stuff- For example Harlequinsprite’s Arm was hovering slightly outside of the Kernel, and Seppucrow was able to peck Dave with its beak, and the Katana was similarly peeking out, so like, Sprites are pretty flexible when it comes to their form and interactability.
Who’s to say he didn’t try and still broke it apart just the same.
It’d seem it literally yanks them out from the Bubbles, if they’re there.
They’re technically bound to the service of the Player, I can’t imagine any reason why a Sprite would turn against its Player, except maybe extreme corruption?
Yep. There’s actually TWO Solluxes in the Bubbles it seems, and potentially two Aradias as well. A Fully Alive, Fully Blind Sollux, and a Sollux that’s Half Dead and Half Blind. We see Fully Blind Sollux in Collide, and Half-Dead Sollux on Terezi: Remem8er.
Yet another instance of Karma trickling down onto the descendants.