after a month of burying myself to the neck in meta posts, i still feel like the beforus trolls are... the least planned aspect of homestuck? like the ancestors' story introduced in murderstuck felt like it applied to the alternian trolls specifically, and while the beforan trolls are good characters on their own, and many of them were written to fit into the karmic cycle with the events on alternia, in the end they just don't quite fit 100%, in a way that kinda bothers me (1/2

2/2) the dolorosa looking more kanaya than porrim is one thing, and then some beforus trolls like latula explaining the seemingly surprising relationships they developed on alternia with a “yeah it just feels right” doesn’t really cut it? maybe the difference in eras they lived in on alternia contributed to it?? it’s like. these small but very glaring holes. i can’t help but notice they’re there

The thing is, I don’t quite think the Dancestors were meant to be part of this Karmic Cycle at all? The Karma goes down from Ancestors to the Beta Trolls for their actions, but I’m not quite sure you could read the Dancestors to also be involved in that chain. The Beforus Trolls present a few things to the story- It’s possible you can argue they were the least planned part of the story, sure, however they were at the very least planned since Act 5, if not earlier.

The fact Aranea comments about her relationship with Latula showcases that they’re outside of this cycle, they’re dealing with a different set of problems themselves- A showcase of Trolls growing up and developing in a society that’s for all intents and purposes, the polar opposite of Alternian Society, to the point of being similarly oppressive in a reversed way. Lower bloods are given no agency and babied, while Higher bloods are bound to their role of caretakers whether they want it or not. This presents the dichotomy of their societies, while presenting similar problems within them- A supposedly peaceful and great society envisioned by the Sufferer, but they’re all huge teenage messes. And dead, on top of that, they’re there to tie some of the story together, while showing that there’s no such a thing as ‘biologically good or bad’, to tell us how Trolls born and raised on hyper violent Alternia could be happy and kind and try to change the world for the better, while Trolls born on paradisiac Beforus could be oppressed and extremely violent and manipulative. This ties well with the themes running through most of the story, about identity and the self, while also posing a challenge to the Trolls that are suddenly faced with figures they have a connection too but are completely different at the same time.

On top of that, it adds a layer of meta-commentary by having the Dancestors embody different facets of the Online Experience, everything from porn and lewdness to Social Justice to Feminism, passing through Dudebros and 4Chan Incoherency and Kin Personalities. But the biggest thing the Dancestors give us is… Classpect Information. To learn more about the Classes, specially, the Dancestors are a huge source of information, and specifically, of Classes that didn’t manage to fulfil their potential, but where you can see the traits of their Classes.

They are the Ancestors grown in another Era, in a different Society. They weren’t the origin of the Trolls’ Karmic Cycle, and as such, are separate from it, their personalities and goals diverge from what you may think of the Ancestors, and yet they are still the same people at the very basis. The Sufferer was a revolutionary because he saw good while raised in an awful society, and was accompanied by a set of people with their own issues that also shaped his ideals, specially with the Dolorosa raising him. Kankri, on the other hand, is born in a society that’s pretty surely bent on babying him to the extreme, and as such his views become more self-centered and ignores others’ advice and points of view. Horuss tried to grow up as everything his caste expected him to be, but ended up coming up with nothing. Given Nothing by his World, he went into an identity crisis and came up with the fact he’s Horse Kin. This may seem random and unrelated to the E%ecutor, but if you think about it, Darkleer was a proper Highblood Executor, raised by a society that told him to feel no pity on the Lower Bloods… But at the moment of taking the Disciple, he learned to empathize with them. He couldn’t bring himself to kill her, and so he… Didn’t. Which led to his exile, and an identity crisis that lasted for sweeps. He’s obviously still tormented by the time Mindfang gets him to make her arm- He cannot find himself, what he is supposed to do.

Rufioh, a Rogue of Breath, wants to spreads his wings, isolate himself from the society that wants to coddle him, and ends up challenging the elders of the surrounding villages to take leadership from them. Living in a more carefree environment, he’s more… Laid back and chill. People seem to look up to him and follow him naturally, and he dislikes that. Compare that to the Summoner- Who instead of trying to be coddled, is a mutant with wings on a society that kills lowbloods for less than that. There’s no way to isolate himself or go away in a society like that, to be free requires a change in the social order, and much like Rufioh, people look up to him. A Rebel leader, challenging the social order to take Leadership from them, to be Free. Meulin is easily shaped by others’ ideals, and has a deep zeal for relationships and love. On Beforus, Kurloz corrupted her and manipulates her into the Highblood Cult, and she clings to him as friends even after breaking up, as well as obviously adores anything gossipy and feelsy. As the Disciple, instead, she’s shown these ideals of goodness and love the Sufferer is preaching, and is absolutely entranced by them. She clings to him, and these, instead, to the point of obsession. In a violent world that took what she loved the most away from her? Rather than being the happy shipper she was, she tried to make the word that she was so obsessed with last through the centuries.

If you focus on the Karmic Cycle, you won’t find an answer with the Dancestors, I don’t think. But when you focus on their Classpect and their overall Personality Traits, the similarities really happen to show through Post and Pre Scratch. A difference of the worlds, a meta-commentary on the Internet at large, an interesting showcase of Classpects. Irrelevant? Perhaps. But I personally like the world-building they bring to the table.