“i hate small talk, why dont people talk about meaningfull shit anymor-” OKAY smartass which entities would be most likely to feed on you and scare you the most vs with which ones are you most alligned
I feel like putting meta plot at the beginning of the episode makes it harder to enjoy the statements.
Don’t get me wrong, I like the new formatting of the show, but it makes the statements feel intrusive. I was honestly too busy wondering what’s going to happen to Sam to listen to the statement.
Like, in ep 146 of The Magnus Archives, they have the confrontation about Jon feeding on people, which ends with them deciding to go to Hilltop Road, the next episode starts with them at Hilltop Road. There’s not a random statement before the conclusion of the cliffhanger; it’d be like if ep 147 started with Martin reading a statement and then we see how Hilltop Road goes.
I started listening to Midnight Burger (on ep 20) here are some of my thoughts (in no particular order):
I like all the characters, but I’d say my favorite character is Caspar.
I totally thought it was going to turn out that Caspar was a child when he first found the diner, and the Mucklewains (No clue how to spell that) where kinda his psuedo parents and that’s why he was so distressed when the channel changed, and why he was so defensive of them.
also thought that the “Management” that Caspar mentioned in ep 1 was who took him after the diner wasn’t open for 3 days.
Good for Effie and Zebulon on being the Hot Ones.
Also thought that Caspar was somehow what made the diner be able to time travel
I will admit, I honestly didn’t like Gloria’s Ted rebellion, mainly cause I feel like the diner is a neutral party, just that being that active in conflicts felt antithetical to what it is. Not that it would necessarily help the Teds, but like it just wouldn’t be such an active opposing force. (I don’t know what I’m trying to say here, it just felt off to me.)
no offense to Chuck, but their voice creeps me out.
I know this is going to be a long rant, but honestly, Caspar shouldn’t have been the only one to apologize.
He never would have tossed her into space if she hadn’t put them all in that situation. Like, what Ava did was, to me, way worse.
Caspar told her what his plan was, Ava gave absolutely no warning.
Caspar gave her a choice to do it willingly, Ava didn’t give anyone a choice.
Caspar checked that it was safe, Ava had no idea if she was putting everyone in danger.
Maybe I’m being too harsh, and I know I am biased towards Caspar, but Ava is honestly being such a hypocrite.
“No. I’m not going to forgive you. I’m also not going to apologize for betraying your trust and doing the one thing you asked me not to do. Yeah, you were right, the suit was safe, but I’m still not going to forgive you for making my actions have actual consequences for me.
Actually, I’m even going to insult you, and say that you’re being a selfish asshole for having feelings, and insinuate that you always get your way, never mind the fact that I, Ava, almost always make everyone go along with what I say, because I’m smart and the rest of you are idiots.
And now I’m even going to insult you further by basically telling you to your face that you’re useless and nobody even likes you, we only tolerate you.”
Honestly, if you ask me, Caspar didn’t need to tell Ava about his son, he doesn’t need to justify his place at the diner. The diner is a place for people who need it, and no one should have to tell the others why.
Sure, Caspar knows the others’ reasons, because he’s been at the diner the longest, but he’s not prying, or demanding they tell him.
I felt the same about Effie and Zebulon not wanting to tell them about why people left their church. They clearly didn’t want to talk about it, (I think they might have said that word for word) the others should have just dropped the subject.
Like sure, eventually Caspar should have told them about his son, but it should have been because he trusts them and wanted to share it. Not because he was made to justify his place at the diner.
I know I just bashed Ava a lot, but I don’t hate her, I just think she’s in the wrong here, but the narrative kinda makes it seem she’s right.
I know Caspar calls her out, but he’s the only one to do so, and he folds on the point pretty quickly.
Ok, so I know in my last Midnight Burger post I already ranted about how I think Ava was in the wrong, but I’m going to rant some more.
(It is very long, and probably a bit incomprehensible.)
At the time, I was on ep 20, I assumed that she would get some growth and Caspar might not put up with her bullshit as much, but instead she just continues to be always right and justified in her behavior, and quite honestly, it’s driving me insane.
Ava has, throughout the entire show, been incredibly rude to just about every single character, she constantly calls everyone idiots, including Leif, one of the best engineers in the galaxy.
When asked the very reasonable question of why these two astrophysicists should let her in to their observatory her response is to say she’s smarter than them. It is so incredibly rude, Ava isn’t a astrophysicists, she’s a theoretical physicists; why would she know more than them, the astrophysicists, on astrophysics?
It’s like she can’t help insulting everyone she meets, and I understand that she is a woman in a male dominated field, but literally no one has ever doubted her intelligence. Not once has a character thought that she is unqualified or belittled her. It’s not like everyone doesn’t believe in her, and she’s set on proving them wrong; she’s just being a jerk.
And if it was like, her behavior got in the way of all her relationships and she needs to learn to be more empathetic and connect to others, then I wouldn’t mind it as much, but her relationships are more or less fine with everyone. The only character you could argue she has any issues with is Caspar, but that’s more about the unsaid feelings than her general attitude.
She’s not even an emotionless scientist, which I guess good on her not being a stereotype, but then it just means she’s can understand other people, and maybe empathize with them, and chooses to insult them ALL. THE. TIME. She CAN be nice and be thoughtful, like how she walked Clementine through her panic, but she decides to verbally demean everyone instead.
I’m not even saying she should try to be nice, just stop bullying the people who care and are always there for her. Like, it’s nice she and Leif get to talk about science things, but she can’t go 20 seconds without calling him dumb or saying how smart she is.
She complains about Clementine not facing any consequences, like Clementine didn’t get burdened with everlasting guilt and was about to be torn apart a couple hours before. But thinks it’s completely fine that she essentially got off Scot-free after potentially endangering everyone at the diner. (Yes, she got shot in to space, but Caspar was right, it was safe, and she even got the answers she wanted.)
Like, I’m sorry, but what the hell kind of response is a smug “your welcome” to “hey, yeah, so all that stuff you said to me actually hurt a lot, and it emotionally scarred me.” Like, can you not for two minutes? Are you seriously incapable of being kind for a single moment!?
She is so flawed, but also a Mary Sue; like the flaws are there, but they’re almost never addressed, and when they are, they get dropped easily or forgiven immediately.
To me, it’s not charming; I don’t like when a male character is hubristic but always right and always gets the last word, and I still don’t like it when a female character does it.
And I know, she, finally, decides to “change” but has she really? I haven’t listened too much past that episode, but that doesn’t negate her previous actions.
Some of my favorite TMA fanarts are ones where Jon’s just in his office or something. And one of my favorite things is when they put a green banker’s lamp on his desk.
I don’t know who started it, but anyone who does, you are so right. This is 100% the lamp I imagine would be in the Head Archivist’s office.
In a Q&A, it’s said that, before all the Horrors, Jon collected something. Something odd, not like coins or stamps.
My headcanon is that he collected some sort of blind box collectibles, I don’t what exactly, but one of the ones that has a mystery option.
And he kept collecting them because he had to know what the mystery one was. But he just kept getting the ones on the box, and he didn’t know what to do with them, so he keeps them.
He doesn’t want to give them away and let everyone know he buys them, he probably thinks it’s rather silly that he’s getting them at all, but he just has to know what the mystery one is.
think of a fictional character - any character, just the first one who comes to your mind. you now live with them, in their living situation, for the rest of your life. you will be given food and water, but other needs are covered by the characters ability to support them. how are you doing?
people point to Jon not blinding himself in Season 4 as the main example of his insatiable curiosity being his tragic flaw that leads to his downfall but honestly given the evidence available to us the audience I don't think it was ever an option for Jon. he DIED, he was DEAD, he was being kept alive by the Eye. we are never given any indication that it is possible for an Avatar to regain their humanity, and that actually being possible would be pretty lore- and tone-shattering for TMA. this tells me that either Jon would've been unable to symbolically reject the Eye by blinding himself, or that he could've done it but it would've killed him. heck in that very same season we are shown how Daisy being cut off from the Hunt makes her terminally(!!!) ill, the only thing that can keep her alive at that point is her connection with her Entity.
If the choice that Jon faced in S4 was "risk everyone's lives and keep his coworkers trapped at the Institute by continuing to indulge his insatiable curiosity vs. blinding himself to get his and his coworkers' freedom at the cost of his eyesight and the chance to Learn More" then yeah I'd say Jon made the wrong choice, but that wasn't the choice he was facing. The choice was "risk everyone's lives and keep his coworkers trapped at the Institute by continuing to indulge his insatiable curiosity vs. getting his coworkers' freedom by literally killing himself". And that is a VERY different situation! Maybe others might still argue that Jon was in the wrong but I can't for a moment agree with the idea that Jon was morally obligated to kill himself.
Honestly the fact that this is barely brought up in the story is kind of weird because Jon was looking for any excuse for his actions at that point so the fact that he DIDN'T latch on to the idea that no, he can't blind himself because he would *literally die*, feels like a missed opportunity, and also has resulted in people treating the situation like Jon had an actual choice between two options that both involved big personal sacrifice but both had merits, when all available evidence tells me that's not the truth of the situation at all.
I feel like it should also be noted that Jon didn’t even know that him dying would free the others. (Not that had he known he should have died for them.)
So the choice is more “keep his powers, which at the moment is the only thing the archives have as an advantage against other avatars, at the cost of his victims having nightmares” vs. “blind himself, maybe die, for the possibility of derailing Elias’s plot, that he doesn’t know what is, and leave the others in the archives to fend for themselves.”
I also don’t think he would actually be able to do it himself, he had trouble even picking up the tape of Eric’s statement, I don’t think he’d be able to use anything to damage his eyes.
Even if he could do it without dying he would be blind with absolutely no support in place. Honestly, the only reason Melanie could make that decision was because she had a support system in place.
Meanwhile for Jon, Georgie has cut him off and Martin just explicitly told him no, the only other people he could even think to turn to are Daisy, Basira, and Melanie. So he wouldn’t even be able to leave the archives anyway (as far as he knows) unless they all blinded themselves together.
And with the exception of maybe Daisy, they 100% wouldn’t want to care for him while he’s recovering. Basira would consider him “dead weight” just like she does Daisy and Melanie, and at least they still have all 5 senses. Daisy would probably be Jon’s only support, but even then, she’s still dealing with the Hunt and all that, so she’s got her own stuff to deal with. I don’t even know what Melanie would have done.
Sorry for the long ask, but I need to get this out of my chest.
Do really people think Jon is a submissive poor baby??
He's the most dominant character in the whole show. He acts in the way he thinks it's right, without (mostly) asking for advice or permission. He fucks up a lot because of this (and because he doesn't take other's people feelings into consideration). Other characters with dominant personalities (like Melanie!) accuse him of being an asshole even when it's not deserved because they perceive him as an authority figure. He takes decisions=he takes responsibility.
It doesn't mean he doesn't get tricked by Jonah, or influenced in other ways, still he perceives them as his choices. He feels guilty about things he has no control on because he feels he needs to have control of any situation. Jon's biggest flaw is that he's arrogant.
Also,
the power imbalance between Jon and Martin isn't because Martin is a little bit of an asshole (??) it's because Jon is literally a supernatural creature and the only reason he didn't go mad in Season 5 it's because he loves Martin. Still, he clearly doesn't take Martin's opinion into account most of the time, he mostly sees him as someone to protect. Again, putting himself in an authority role, they are not equal in the relationship.
Martin's character arc finishes with his relationship with Jon, his character is completely fulfilled by it, while Jon is doing his shit and he needs Martin just because he chooses to. It would be so interesting to see their relationship grow. Jon learns that he doesn't need to be always in control and he can rely on Martin. Martin learns how to love himself -through Jon's loving him- and how to build meaningful relationships with other people, knowing that he's loved even when he isn't a perfect sweet baby.
Ooo I like what youre saying. Yea. I do think Jons somewhat submissive when he gets backlash for his actions sort of in a ‘Better to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission’ kind of way if that makes sense. With scenes where hes confronted hell stand up for himself a bit before agreeing and going along with wtv ppl say. Idk if that makes sense and Im misremembering some things but yea - rosette
sorry nonny & rosette i misread that question for a second . but i agree w/rosette ! jon’s generally very anxious when it comes to backlash and he’ll do what he can to avoid it / avoid confrontation . etc etc . yeag - deceit
Like they said, I think he is very anxious. A lot of his actions aren’t really him trying to be dominant or something, and he is often “ready to conform to the authority and/or will of other” (google definition of “submissive”) he’s just incredibly bad at it.
He’ll be like “Yes, of course you’re right. I will wait for you before jumping into the coffin,” but of course, he goes into the coffin anyways, it’s not as if he’s trying to undermine the others and show his dominance, he’s just gets the overwhelming need to do something that it overpowers his quote unquote submission.
I wouldn’t really say he’s arrogant though, even in season 1, he’s stuffy and uptight, but he doesn’t really give me the vibe that he thinks he’s better or more important than anyone else. The most arrogant I can think of him being is with Melanie in her first statement, but even that was more pride for the institute as a whole rather than himself specifically.
Also, I don’t think Martin is the reason Jon didn’t go mad in season 5. I think he would have more easily lost hope without Martin and would have just settled with the horrible new world, but he wouldn’t go “mad,” he wouldn’t have become a sadistic fear eating monster without Martin, and I feel like saying he would discredits his character.
Also which of martin’s opinions should he have taken to heart? His “let’s kill all of these avatars, because they’re the worst things ever and should all die!” opinion, (not acknowledging Jon is an avatar) or his “let’s send all of the literal eldritch horrors to another dimension, because I decided the Web isn’t actually that bad, right?” opinion? Jon didn’t take Martin’s opinions into account because Martin didn’t understand the full scope of things like Jon did.
I’m honestly a bit confused by the last part, While I do think Jon’s relationship with control is a very interesting thing to explore, I don’t really think Jon is ever trying to control others, or even a situation, just that he is in control of himself, so I don’t know how relying on Martin would help.
