do you have any(strong) opinions on fanon char designs that aren't jonahs?
I was going to say I don't have any strong opinions on anyone but Jonah but actually I do. starting with Peter Lukas!
most of the fanart of him is so... cartoon sailor that just doesn't make sense for his character. it also looks even more ridiculous when paired with "waifish twink" Elias. he is as much of a captain as jeff bezos an astronaut and the whole reason he is sailing in the first place is to feed the Lonely. he doesn't have a beard! which we can deduce from the statement giver in mag 33 not mentioning it despite doing so for the first mate. Peter Lukas is a businessman who happens to enjoy sailing because it's the most isolated he can be while also sustaining his god. he was even a landlord! I can talk about it more but there is some other stuff design wise I want to talk about
I understand why people draw Daisy as butch. I really do. but also I dislike the automatic equation of violence to masculinity when Daisy canonically goes by that name because she like show feminine it sounds. she enjoys this duality of outward femininity paired with her violent nature. I am all for more butches but you could actually make Basira butch too then, make them butch4butch idk. or Georgie!
now, what i am about to say applies to both Jon and martin. I think it's great people create representation for themselves but they are both so so white in their attitude towards the police. Jon less so but he is still very blasé about the whole murder suspect thing, he is also very surprised when he learns that Basira doesn't trust him and actively suspects him. and of course martin's whole "but they are the police". you see what I mean? but also people creating representation for themselves is great
now, Jon. I don't have anything against him being drawn wearing a skirt or dresses but also you have to remember that this man lies about his age and plays up his accent to seem more professional and respectable. and while I'd love for it to be okay for men to wear skirts and still be seen as professional, it's just not how things are. and Jon would be keenly aware of it. s3 and later? eh. but that's my own feelings about skirts and femininity
no character could fill Gertrude's shoes and defeat Jonah, preventing the Apocalypse. for one, Gertrude herself was unable to accomplish that. her disappearance/death is the first thing we learn. the reason why Gertrude was able to do her thing and stay hidden from Jonah was because he both respected her and knew that whatever she did would also benefit him (he wanted the rituals stopped back then). it likely took years for that respect to grow and for him to grow complacent. comfortable. that character wouldn't have that. Jonah wouldn't care about them stopping the rituals because he now knows they don't work. because of Gertrude he'd be more careful. he wouldn't let them stay out of his Sight. like when he goes to Jon's office when he can't see who Jon is talking to. that character wouldn't be allowed the same freedoms Gertrude were because Jonah both has the experience and also he has planned his ritual already
in the end of the day it doesn't matter if a character is "like Gertrude". they wouldn't succeed either way, both because the actual Gertrude didn't and because Jonah would be more prepared this time around
I just finished listening to the entire podcast on YouTube and all the comments were hyping Martin and jmart in general up since the beginning but when I was actually listening to their dialogues and their interactions it was just so, alright?
Maybe I’m taking crazy but it feels weird to me that the main relationship in the story is built upon the fact that they were really the other’s only available option that is “morally correct,” rather than a deeper connection and attraction of not only on what the other represented in the past but also their developing attitudes and characteristic as the story progresses as their humanity gets ripped from them, in summary, they suck at adapting to their new situation which I find very frustrating but I guess is realistic, that it leaves Jon to be in such a distressing state and prolonged in accepting his new situation of no longer being fully human. If he just had a more supportive network of people with an actual brain that can think for a second to maybe not blame the guy who wasn’t even present when they joined the institute, so much of canon could have gone about a lot better.
One could argue that this lack of development stems from the fact that they’re in the middle of the apocalypse, and that we don’t hear the full nuance of their relationship because of how the podcast’s narrative is with the statements being the focal point, which is fair, but they’re a lot of apocalyptic settings type narratives with two male characters that aren’t even official, but have more of an engaging dynamic than jmart, take the pairing of joongdok from Omniscient Reader’s Viewpoint for example, reading the actual novel it’s oblivious that none of the fandom ships will be canon but their interactions are such a hook and tragic that the readers are left longing for more of /them/, those two characters who as individuals are already compelling but when at each other’s side, no one can argue that they make a good team with or without the shipping lenses, and this is still clear even after arcs where they dont even see each other for YEARS, while jmart is glued at the hips for a lot of the later seasons and is still giving a passing grade.
For jmart, even after listening to the podcast, people long for the fanon version they made up because the actual content material leaves us with something so plain it could rival the UK’s entire cuisine.
If ONLY they didn’t forced this codependency with jmart and allow for Jon to explore in having different dynamics with the other characters more which relationships would actually stay relevant to the story and not have all of them follow the same mindset of blame Jon and ditching him, well, with Martin. It’s such a missed opportunity, Jonny Sims let me be the devil on your shoulder if you ever decide to write an alternate universe.
I would have loved if we got more of Jon and Elias/Jonah instead, for the main character and focal antagonist’s relationship to be sidelined as it was in the podcast drives me up the wall because these two are genuinely the only ones in that cast keeping me engaged with the story, build upon multitudes of parallels and a raw sense of understanding that you could taste and bite into whenever they interact and do their little mind games. See I don’t even want JonElias to be in a relationship with each other in canon, they just need to be in each other’s orbit, physically and mentally.
ok wow that’s a lot, sorry if some of this doesn’t makes sense I’m just writing down everything on my mind as quickly as possible. - 🪸
You said basically everything I've been posting about since starting this account so there's not much for me to add.
I'll just say - I will forever remain a jmart hater because not only was that underdeveloped relationship the focus of an entire season and the whole podcast's ending, it's also the main if not the only thing tma fans talk about. It could've been compelling and interesting but the execution was not it. These two barely talked before s5 and so having them suddenly become a couple in the beginning of the last season was hinged on the assumption that you already shipped them. Which I didn't. And then the emotional aspect of the ending was also hinged on the assumption that you cared about these two - as a unit - ending up somewhere else. And I did not care at all
Also when I said that I wished Jon had longer relevant dynamics with other characters that differ in some way doesn’t mean that I want him to like, come out of it being the fanon depiction of him in domestic bliss. No, Jon being tortured is what I signed and waited in line for, with the safety bar set in place for my comfort and enjoyment, not his, this man is meant to walk through the horrors and come out as something so out of left field that it’ll leave readers scarred and stop the video to walk around their rooms to contemplate on what they just heard. - 🪸
See that's a problem. We could have had all the interesting fear-related horrors happening but all we got was two coworkers in a relationship arguing. Jon going Mahtin it all horrible and I feel scared and guilty for what I've caused and I have to witness it all and Martin responding Oh Jon I love you but can you stop telling me this it makes me uncomfortable and also I'll keep making off handed comments about how all avatars are pure evil which coincidentally includes you but not me of course cause everyone conveniently forgot I serve the Lonely. This is an overexaggeration if you couldn't tell btw
All season 5 had to offer was a romantic relationship. And it wasn't even related to the omnipresent horrors are you kidding me
Please let me forget about the magnus archives it's not even that good please I want to be done here I don't want to think about jonathan archivist sims anymore
Please let me forget about the magnus archives it's not even that good please I want to be done here I don't want to think about jonathan archivist sims anymore
You only start to notice how much a specific thing has become a part of yourself when you try to get rid of it. Why do I care so much about something that's not real
it’s kinda crazy how like. 90% of the people who interact with jonah as a character completely skip over the sentence I first attempted prevention but the cause seemed hopeless. paying heed to his own words (which are to be held true or the statement wouldn’t have been caught on tape) he did not decide to seek power when he first discovered them (he felt curiosity and fear); nor he did so when his companions became entangled with one of the Entities; NOR when the Rituals became an active threat. he was curious, he studied them, he attempted prevention. discussing privilege around jonah is like kicking a dead horse and I shall never go there but it’s insane to me how his first instinct (or choice, either way) was not to exploit the powers to his gain and to bring the Change into the world itself but to stop it from happening and only inverted his route upon discovering that his crusade was meaningless, that there was no hope for any concrete damage control. this is why I will always, always object to any conception of jonah magnus that doesn’t start with him as a good person. sorry.
I'm so glad I don't know whats going on with the magnus protocol cause all the coolest people I follow seem to be going through the horrors because of it
i do think we should popularise the term "fandom death spiral" for that thing where a fandom with no new content starts just shipping willy-nilly and flanderizing and woobifying and tropifying and fanonizing over and over and over again in an effort to Make New Things to the point where nothing in fandom is even related to the source material anymore. like this is an observable phenomenon
Thinking about how Basira has to believe that passively allowing murder/horror is different and better than causing it yourself, because if they’re the same, then she’s responsible for all of Daisy’s crimes.
i have never met people more willing to analyze tma as a piece of art and social commentary than elias fans. mr sims you actively mocked the only subgroup of people who actually got something besides generic mlm ship number 253 out of your work
My hot take is that while Jon made mistakes (that he was encouraged into by those manipulating him) throughout the podcast his only morally wrong acts were those that Martin pressured him into (murder, dooming the multiverse). This is not to say that he is blameless for those things, but any criticism of his actions in season five has to begin by acknowledging that his boyfriend sucks.
I’ve never seen it being discussed but mag199 is one of the most important episodes in the show and is crucial for understanding Jon’s character and his choices.
Characters here need to make a choice and everyone gives their take on situation. Except for Jon. The first people to talk are everyone present in the room and Jon is the LAST person who says something here.
And when he says that they actually have more options, his words immediately get dismissed by Melanie and Martin. Through the whole conversation the only words Jon gets to say are some unnecessary corrections and weak protests. But he never gets to say his piece fully.
Again, the person who’s the only one able to change world back, is the last one who gets a word to say.
From Jon’s POV, here he is, again, viewed only as a tool. Here he is, again, not the one to actually decide what to do with the world. He is, again, forced to do something he doesn’t want and his own will does not matter.
And this is crucial for his actions in mag200. He never wanted the option everyone else agreed on, and still he is expected to follow the path that was carved out for him. He never chose to be marked by the Web, he never chose to end the world. And he didn’t want to let the fears free. This choice was made for him.
But still, for the first time HE is the one holding all the cards now and finally, FINALLY be the only one to decide how to play them.
And he does just that.
i think the tags from @cosmic-crunch should be immortalized
I really didn't want to do this, but I'm annoyed right now.
I do not hate Martin. Not like you do. I'm a bit into season 3 rn, (don't worry, you can say what you want. I'm spoilered to death and back xD), and I haven't found anything hate worthy about him yet. I don't feel strongly about him.
That said, I am not so slowly, but all the more surely starting to hate him just because of the fact that every single time I try to find jonelias fics on ao3, I get jmart fics. The only way I can get around it is by blocking both the jmart and the martin blackwood tag! And even then! I want to read jonelias fics that have martin in them! I want him to suffer in his unrequited crush, I don't mind him!
But every time I fail to filter out these two tags, it's just 'Elias and Jon are I'm an abusive relationship. Luckily, here is Martin to save him!' 'Fantasy AU, Elias keeps Jon locked up and heavily abuses/tortures him. Here's Martin to the rescue!' 'Jon and Elias are in a relationship (that may or may not be abusive), but oh no! Jon's fallen in love with Martin! Good that Elias is such a jerk that he deserved that.' 'Elias fucking raped Jon'?!
I see a long fic with the jmart ship tag in 4th place, far behind jonelias? Doesn't matter. They're still endgame. I see a jonelias fic that's part of a series? Three fics later, the jonelias tag is gone bc Elias was... some flavour of evil and jmart is endgame.
It is so disgustingly annoying, and it is genuinely making me hate Martin. I am this close to writing a fic where Jmart are in an abusive relationship (you're giving me so much ammunition to work with there) and Elias is the one to save Jon, or maybe he's the one Jon falls in love and cheats with, idk yet...
(Sorry for the long ask. If I remember correctly from skimming your blog, you're not really a jonelias fan, so this may be completely uninteresting to you, but I just tried looking for fics again, and I got so angry that I needed to vent. I hope you don't mind 😅)
omg i knowwww and like on a similar vein to this like i've blocked the jmart tags and everything here because like i just don't wanna see that but then so many people clog up random ships with those tags and somehow it's STILL a problem i have to see 😭 like leave me alone bro stay in your lane 🥀
There is a conversation to be had about prevailing fandom trends toward shitposting/intended-as-comedy/intended-as-absurdism short tumblr posts that are divorced entirely from canon becoming one of the dominant forms of content, and how that content influences the production of other forms of content including art but particularly fic, and how it’s driving the “all canon is ours now to toss out the window and call it transformative I guess” style of things.
There is a conversation to be had about that, and how it’s warping what transformativity as a means of engagement with media means. Problem is, it’s become tangled up with the “all literature and actually all storytelling ever is fanfiction” discourse, and so many people seem to define their personalities by their place in fandom subculture, that it’s becoming impossible to criticise fandom without being labelled a no good meanie fun hater and also an elitist snob who just can’t stand for people to enjoy themselves. Every time a conversation about this gains any traction, someone has to slam down like the hand of god to remind everyone that it’s actually okay to have fun!, and the actual intent of the conversation is lost, because it’s more important than anything that we soothe hurt feelings.
The thing is, it’s not only the feelings of the people who can only parse new content through old tropes that matter. There are people out there - and this may seem shocking to many of you - who don’t hate the canon on which their fandom is based. People who want to engage with the themes and storylines and world of their preferred canon in a way that probably gets them accused of being boring sticklers. Strangely enough, this is an equally “valid” way of engaging with media! Just because it doesn’t tickle your funny bone or tick your trope bingo boxes doesn’t make it bad!
It is increasingly difficult to find fanworks that relate meaningfully to the canons, across many fandoms, on which they’re purportedly based. I’ve seen some people put this down to “oh well, we’re all in lockdown and need a fun escape so being serious would be bad for our mental health” - okay, fine. That makes sense for some people. But it still doesn’t explain the strong trend over the past three years where every fandom seems to have taken the same journey to the same trends, where all canons must be beaten to the same tune.
I couldn't care less about the magnus protocol but if anyone's up to date on it can you tell me what happened to the needles guy. Were they mentioned again or no
I agree with people saying that a ship being canon doesn't mean it's good or better than your fanon ships but some of y'all have to understand as well that many of your fanon ships actually fucking suck
Something hit me rn. The reason why the s5 ending irritates me as much as it does is because it's framed as good and hopeful, cause "Jon and Martin might've ended up somewhere else" and THAT is what most fans focus on, the hope that "my cuties might end up somewhere else and be happy together 🥺🥹🥹 they're happy somewhere else 🥹🥹" and not on the fact that 1) the choice to doom countless other universes to **maybe** save their own was very selfish and 2) Martin went behind Jon's back and stripped him of the only choice he could've made without being manipulated in the entire podcast. And then made him go along with the plan of the entity that orchestrated his entire life. "My babies are happy somewhere else right???" After that kind of lack of communication from either sides?? Yeah I'm sure. They're definitely happily married and live in a cottage house with three cats. If that's what you find most compelling in a horror fiction podcast
Thinking about the fact that canonically Jon was talked about behind his back by not just his ‘friends’ but by other workers at the institute. Thinking about how Jon canonically doesn’t have friends throughout the podcast and beyond. Thinking about how this is just an extension of the fact Jon was unwanted and shown how unwanted he was as a child by not just his grandmother but by a boy twice his age and likely his peers as well. Thinking about how isolated and hated he was even before he started on the path to becoming the Archivist.
Just saw a very popular post full of outrage at the fact that anyone could even hate Martin. Very entitled, imo. Us Jonah fans have been in the trenches for years and we don't even complain about people hating him; we complain about people expressing said hate in his tag as a breach of etiquette. Grow up. People are allowed to hate characters. It's as valid a form of engagement as any.
I can't with these people 😭😭not only are they asking you a very meaningless question (well obviously you hate martin otherwise you wouldn't have this blog and obviously it's not that deep cause the majority of your posts are really unserious. Whether it's all an elaborate bit or you really dislike a fictional guy it doesn't matter cause it doesn't affect them in the slightest) but they feel the need to overexplain themselves cause god forbid they come off as anything else than a sweet clueless child.
I dont know about you but if i were the one to send a random blog an **anonymous** ask i don't think it would be necessary to explain that im autistic and dont know how to read tone (the answer to their question is in the blog plus YOUVE BEEN ASKED THAT EXACT QUESTION SEVERAL TIMES ALREADY, if they actually cared they could just dedicate a few minutes to scrolling ur blog) and also they highlight how much of a cutie sweetie pie lovely boy martin is and how hes actually my favourite character. Youre exposing yourself to a stranger on the internet for no reason. I know youre just a silly guy mr hater but anyone else could take that as an invitation to insult the asker and theyre kiiinda putting a target on their forehead telling a stranger all that. On the internet you need to take care of your own safety
Sorryyy lol this turned into a meaningless rant i just had to vent. The lack of self-preservation instinct in young teens online has been annoying me for a long time..... its grinding my gears how so many people here feel the need to justify everything they say when its just unnecessary and in the worst case can cause them harm and in the best case can lead to them being called out for their ignorance. Why are you sending an ANONYMOUS ask to martinblackwoodhater and offhandedly mentioning you love martin
oh yeah literally and also like idk what people always feel the need to make sure everyone KNOWS they don't agree with me lmao it's like buddy you're chill no one actually gaf about how you feel abt martin over here 😭😭
I keep forgetting I'm one of the few fans whose mind and soul were completely consumed by tma. I go anywhere online to look for fandom content and realize ohhhh so you guys only care about opposite aesthetic gay people. The average person getting into a horror fiction podcast does not care about the horror fiction
What if I headcanon that one of the things Jon’s bully stole from him was something that had belonged to one of his parents. What if I add to the immeasurable pain I feel over baby Jon.
His grandmother passes and his tiny London flat has no room for all her things and the memories they bring. It’s okay, didn’t need it much anyway.
He goes on the run with no time to even go home to grab a spare change of clothes. Who knows what was lost or broken as the police search his flat and his lease expires.
He wakes up from his coma, and even the change of clothes he kept in his office is thrown away. It’s okay, he’s used to this now. What’s losing everything he owns when he’s already lost his life and humanity?
He flees to Scotland, barely glancing at what he leaves behind as he stuffs a bag with bare essentials. For once, his hands aren’t empty, because Martin’s is gripped in his.
He hasn’t bothered to collect keepsakes for years; it’s only a matter of time before he loses it all again. But Martin gifted him a teacup with a cat on it after he caught Jon smiling at it. Jon leaves it behind when they set out to save the world.
At the end, he hopes for Somewhere Else, knowing that even that fragile thread of hope will leave their bloodied hands empty. It’s alright. It’s alright. He’s come to expect to lose everything he touches.
Heyy so you know how Jon keeps losing everything he has. His friends. His family. His personal belongings. Parts of his body. Parts of himself. You know how Martin has always kept everyone at a comfortable distance. How he's grown accustomed to the feeling of alienation he feels inside.
What if. Being together brings them comfort. Because they know that eventually, one day, they will both leave. Martin will disappear. He'll distance himself so far from everything that troubles him that he'll be too far for Jon to reach out to. Jon will turn away. The guilt, the hunger, the profound sense of otherness will consume him and he will seek a place to hide like an animal feeling its end drawing near. The distance between them will grow so large they won't be able to reach out and pull each other close once again. And they will be left with nothing one more time. Just as it always had been.
The moment Jon and Martin got in a relationship they both saw only its inevitable end. Every gesture, every word tainted with the feeling that this won't last. Let's hold hands for as long as we can, because we both know we want to let go.
I just saw Alex say Hilltop live had to be all new "but fan favourite content" and this is where he lost me. I understand wanting to cater to fans who are spending money on tickets and travel and all that stuff. but also my fundamental belief is that it's always a bad idea to write with the consideration of what the fans will like and what makes a good story. look at bg3 and what happened to the story once they started changing it to fit the players' desires. and ultimately you won't be able to please everyone so its a lose-lose situation
and obviously, they were focused on writing a good story. but this desire for the content to be "fan favourite" is so clear in Protocol
also "scary but not too scary" ???? boooooo this is a horror podcast, your goal should be scaring the listeners. too bad the audience you've been courting just cares about "opposites attracts" gay couple and not the actual horror in the horror podcast
If you were to take martin out of season 5 the story could only benefit from that. Hes just there for the questionable romantic moments and doesn't have any plot importance otherwise. You couldve just had him give jon the lonely mark and left him in there and then maybe I wouldve even felt bad for him. Plus that would be a fine ending for his character arc. Instead s5 had his whole development come undone like a mediocre sweater and for what. Fabric rustles
As you may know i dont like martin but i gotta admit i have a quiet fondness for ppl who used to headcanon him as polish. It was so obvious none of them spoke the language too. Stumbling through the sentences with google translate in hand..... i dont get it!! Why do u find this appealing if its not relatable to u!! It was sort of fascinating.
Nobody gaf anymore tho. The polish martin tag is silent and empty. Maybe its for the best
The entire time I've been relistening to season 5, I can't stop thinking about Jon Jarchivist's state of existence as a disability metaphor. The role in things he's been crafted for makes other people see him as having special privileges - and yes, there are perks! - but nobody really puts as much thought into how it affects his internal life, or the fact that he never chose this. Even the characters who are nice to him will make the occasional dig at him "always having liked being at the center of things", as if he didn't spend nearly every moment of the last few years trying to minimize his impact on others as much as possible, and seen it happen anyway only in spite of himself. He has a special diet and a requirement to stop and unburden himself regularly that can come on at inconvenient times, sounds physically uncomfortable if left unanswered, and impossible to leave so for long. The things that are good and restful for the others (sanctuaries from the Eye) fatigue and dissociate him, and his needs are always in an awkward balance with the differing ones of those around him, by practicality alone, even when he's with a person who loves him.
So many moments in S5 read like mirrors of myself or my other disabled friends hanging out and traveling with abled friends or ones with differing requirements: the awkward half-apologies that happen when you can't really control something that's being inconvenient and it's unpleasant for you too, the pushing yourself in spite of symptoms for something fun or restful for a loved one and yourself, the strained laughter at well-meaning digs, the struggling not to bring down the mood by explaining too much...it's all there. Being the Archivist is a disability. It is that from the moment the requirement for statements to survive kicks in, but especially especially in Season 5, and that's special to me. I sort of wish some of the other avatars had been more willing to be true allies, so that Jon could've had someone to talk and compare with. I think the company would've made him feel a lot less like a monster. (If, yknow, the company available was not mostly literal monsters or avatars too far gone to have much sympathy, alas)
I love and related to this reading.
I am still not over this.
Martin sets up a strong boundry "I can't be that for you." And thst is just amazing character development for him.
And Jon is like "I can't not though?!?!?! Oh! I can do it without you? Yeah I can do it in private alone. Ok phew. I can respect my boyfriends boundry."
And then EVERY TIME Jon needs to do it Martin is like "REALLY?! NOW? IN FRONT OF MY SALAD?" And THEN he tells Basira "He can't help it."
So you do understand then? So why are you being such an absolute fucking wanker.
Recently i've being seing alot of antishiping proshiping discourse on tiktok against my will again, and with it i realised that i don't really hate Martin or Jmart, i just hate when their fanon versions are seen as canon. Like, i'm a big Elias/Jonah fan, and i often be saying shit like "He's so babygirl" "He did nothing wrong" etc, in a joking way, so it's hypocritical of me to criticise Martin fans for doing the same. But the problem is that TMA is one of those fandoms where the fans have divorced the characters so much from the original source that i'm not really sure if they're just babyfing Martin the same way i do Elias or if they legit think he's a "small bean" in the podcast. Idk if i worded this the best way
I get it. Martin's treated like a stereotypical sweetheart can-do-no-wrong cinnamon roll or just straight up like a self-insert, and jonmartin as a pairing are made to be a generic opposite aesthetics mlm ship #247 and I know this kind of thing happens with fandoms in general but jesus christ
I'm biased cause imo them being canon and the focus in both the last season and the whole podcast's ending was awful. But that aside, they had potential to be explored in fanworks (I mean it wasn't all that in the podcast itself but you could dig deeper if you fancied) but the vast majority of jmart works are just fix-its or some scottish cottage or slowburn office romance or flowershop aus. And that is so boring and generic and untrue to their characters. "What if we took a horror fiction podcast and removed all the creepy icky stuff and left only cute gays in love" that is nothing. You removed the main elements of the thing
